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Crocodile
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2018 1:01 pm    Post subject: New skill idea for Lore Masters Reply with quote

Know Weakness

Description: You know much about your foes, including how to really hurt them.
System: You gain an "Alchemy Strike: ___". Everytime this skill is taken you choose from Quicksilver, Holy Water, Faerrum, or Alkahest to be the alchemy applied to the strike. You may only take an alchemy for which you have a cumulative amount of lores regarding creatures that are affected by that alchemy. For instance, if you have lores: Undead, Greater Undead, Liches, Vampires, Banshee; then you could get 1 purchase of this skill with the Holy Water alchemy.

Signiture Cqll: "Alchemy Strike____"
Uses: 1x per purchase
Skill Cost: 5
Prerequisite: Identify, Loremaster, Lorex5 (cumulative, based on type)




I thought that loremasters should have something that gives them an edge when fighting creatures that they know about. My first thought was to do a +100 dage strike that can only be used on specific creatures, but that'd be difficult to do in the middle of combat. I also thought about just giving them a free Holy Water/etc., but then it'd just stock up as it didn't get used and would be unfair to actual alchemists, so making it a specialty/alchemy strike seems like the better way to go. I'd love to hear any comments, both yays and nays.
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Skywind
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2018 1:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like this altho 5 lores per seems a bit high.. that makes its 15 points for one strike and that's just going to get avoided or blocked most of the time. 2 or 3 lores per seems a bit more fair.


Also with the Alkahest strike you have to be careful to explain that that dos not let you destroy things with it. in order to destroy a tag with an Alkahest you need a counted action not a strike.
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KawasakiNinja
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2018 5:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lores can tell you how best to kill something or stop its regen, then use the other tools in the system to do so (ie: actual alchemy). Like, I'd still buy this if it ever made it into the system, but I don't think the Lore tree needs a combat mechanic.

Now if you want something to know how better to kill/deal with enemies, something to actually see an NPC card would be cool. Just of generic crunchies or things with mass produced character cards (Defilers, etc), not unique named NPCs. Now I also don't think we need something like that, but I'd prefer that route for new skills than combat mechanic applications.

I also don't like the idea of subjective lore interpretations as pre-reqs for skills (as the original post had). # of lores as a pre-req with a lore use going to use some skill (so in my example skill above: using lore undead to see a skeleton mage's card).
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wytenyte
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2018 7:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am sympathetic with Kyle's idea, but I like Daniel's better.
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Spruce
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2018 10:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

One problem I can see is vagueness in determining if someone has the prereqs, since it's basically a judgment call and will in effect just be giving Ray more work, since he'd be the one to look at sheets and double check.

For example, does Lore: Life and Death Cycle give you knowledge about undead? what about Lore: Vampires, does that count as undead or is that too specific? Or Lore: burial ceremonies, since you could say it would give you information on how to keep things from becoming undead.

Do any of those count? Probably not, but someone will have to decide that.
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Casstifer
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 2:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm concerned that this idea of Kyle's may overlap too much with the existing Assassin abilities to envenom their weapons. I do like the idea of some sort of a 'favored enemy' skill, but I think even with something like that, Assassin might be the better tree to place it in, rather than with Lore Master.
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Crocodile
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Plot - Plot

PostPosted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 10:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My base idea is akin to a "favored enemy" type thing.

Since lores are supposed to be approved by the world team before you actually buy them, I don't see much of an issue of needing to run this by them as well.

I don't think it'd interfere with the poison use skills much at all. A base assassin can use all the poisons, so they still retain that, and with master poisoner you get the double use, making a single holywater go twice as far (not including the x3/x5 for arrows), while this skill is limited to a 1-for-1 use.

As for skill points required for this it'd be 40sp to get your first strike, 5sp for second, and 15sp for each one after that. In contrast it's 37sp to get to assassin and 74sp for master poisoner.

I think the ability to stock up alchemy, and get multiple use, is a much better route to go then the skill I'm proposing, but I think that it would serve a role in rewarding a loremaster/monster hunter type for taking lores that fit their characters. The idea is to be more of a roleplay enanching skill then a munchin skill, representing that you know where the weak point is on a specific type of thing.
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KawasakiNinja
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 12:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Crocodile wrote:
My base idea is akin to a "favored enemy" type thing [...] The idea is to be more of a roleplay enanching skill then a munchin skill, representing that you know where the weak point is on a specific type of thing.


Then make it a new suffix to a call, "Bane Demon" or something that has an effect against those enemy types. If you use it against the wrong enemy type, then it's no effect. Eliminates using Alchemy Strike Quicksilver that you got for all your Demon lores on a Werewolf or Lethifold, etc. Also lets it affect things that aren't covered by the 4 alchemies (Bane Human!).

Crocodile wrote:
Since lores are supposed to be approved by the world team before you actually buy them, I don't see much of an issue of needing to run this by them as well.


Obviously I'm not World and they can speak for themselves, but personal opinion is that they have enough to do already (not sure about others, but there's a ton of setting info I'm still waiting on) and would prefer them not to get even MORE added to their plate and delay things even more (new player's guide coming 2010!). Plus they're world/setting, not rules. Also lore use in game is handled by Plot, so it's Plot discretion what it actually does during gameplay. For all those reasons I'd be against subjective lore pre-reqs. If there was a "master list" of lores (or some specific set ones) then that wouldn't be an issue and sure go off that, but not sure if that would ever happen (and kinda ok with it never happening).
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Josh
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Owner - Owner
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 10:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

As has been posted several times, the Player's guide is at https://dev.legacieslarp.org/setting/index.php. It is still being expanded, but it is also not devoid of content

Quote:
Players can choose any subject that they want; however, they must first get permission from both Plot and the World/Character Referee prior to buying the Lore on that subject


This should probably be altered to Game world and Logistics, rather than Plot, as Logistics has the master list of existing lores so has that as a resource to help find the correct label, spans plot teams so ensures greater consistency in what is and is not approved, and because the lores *already* need to be sent to them anyway since they add them to character cards
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Crocodile
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Plot - Plot

PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 10:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually, I think a bane suffix would be a great way to put it.
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Josh
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 10:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Silver, Gold, and Iron weapons already represent "monster weaknesses" in that they confer advantage against monsters of various types, there are already poisons that convey advantages against monsters of a specific type, characters that are inclined to take specific issue with those monsters tend to outfit themselves accordingly, and loremaster *really* isn't a combat tree (I know that humans tend to be vulnerable to decapitation, but that doesn't make me an expert at removing heads with my bare hands)

Moreover, given that rend is already 3 SP and adds +100 damage against everything, I don't think mechanically there is much sense to add another +100 damage skill that can only be used selectively
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KawasakiNinja
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 6:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Josh wrote:
As has been posted several times, the Player's guide is at https://dev.legacieslarp.org/setting/index.php. It is still being expanded, but it is also not devoid of content


That link came up 404, but this works for any others trying it:
https://www.legacieslarp.org/gamebooks/playersGuidePreview1.pdf

And true it's not devoid of content, but it has completely removed sections that were in previous PGs (more than half the races and most of the countries, and other stuff). It also does not have information on the new continents/countries that have been posted in the Game Setting Discussions section of the forums (this PG pre-dates that by a few years).

I'm not trying to jab at what is available, I'm just saying I'd love to see World work on that more than some new rules feature.

Edit: so just noticed the period at the end of the sentence in the link made the 404. So here's it without the period:
https://dev.legacieslarp.org/setting/index.php

Edit 2: So the link I posted first was from the PG that can be found on the non-dev site (so still easily found by most, and geography inaccurate). The dev-PG does have the new countries listed with maps, but no details on them (just placeholder links for future writeups); so still look at the forum post for them.
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